This debate occurred on April 9, 2016 in Atlanta, Georgia. Dustin is a Biblical Unitarian, a Christian who denies Christological Preexistence, that Jesus came from Heaven. David was arguing for Christological Preexistence.
As seen here: youtu.be/EQ1RkLEBIEE?t=46m40s (46:40-47) Dustin claimed that 1 Enoch 69:28 states “The Son of Man will never pass away or perish from the face of the earth.” But it says no such thing, in fact it says regarding the demons that “all their works [will] vanish from the face of the earth.” Quite the opposite then, and not even referring to the Son of Man. However, the Son of Man is referred to in the surrounding verses of 26, 27 and 29, but not in the verse 28 he referred to. But there’s more: ironically, it is this chapter 69 in verse 29 which says the Son of Man has “appeared,” which I think may be referring to a resurrection, in the very chapter that he claimed from his misquote that there was no death and resurrection in. (The passage in chapter 69 verses 26-29 is a fragment of a lost longer passage that was tagged onto the end of 69.)
- Read the whole passage from 1 Enoch (R. H. Charles’ translation) here: www.sacred-texts.com/bib/boe/boe072.htm
- Compare the “chains” to the chains of 54:3-5 for the demons.
- So it’s talking about punishing the demons.
What Dr. Dustin Smith says 1 Enoch 69:28 says:
“The Son of Man will never pass away or perish from the face of the earth.”
What it actually says:
“With chains shall they be bound,
And in their assemblage-place of destruction shall they be imprisoned,
And all their works vanish from the face of the earth.”
A Second Look
As shown above in the website presenting Charles’s translation, the relevant text is in the Close of the Third Parable:26. And there was great joy amongst them,It seems to me that Dustin took the “Son of Man” and “pass away and be destroyed from off the face of the earth” from verse 27, and associated it with the similar closing language of verse 28 “all their works vanish from the face of the earth.” He then appears to have amalgamated these expressions into one with his personal twist going from the curse on the Son of Man’s enemies ‘passing away and being destroyed from off the face of the earth’ to a blessing upon the Son of Man himself to “never pass away or perish from the face of the earth,” and then assigning his new text as verse 28.
And they blessed and glorified and extolled
Because the name of that Son of Man had been revealed unto them.
27. And he sat on the throne of his glory,
And the sum of judgement was given unto the Son of Man,
And he caused the sinners to pass away and be destroyed from off the face of the earth,
And those who have led the world astray.
28. With chains shall they be bound,
And in their assemblage-place of destruction shall they be imprisoned,
And all their works vanish from the face of the earth.
29. And from henceforth there shall be nothing corruptible;
For that Son of Man has appeared,
And has seated himself on the throne of his glory,
And all evil shall pass away before his face,
And the word of that Son of Man shall go forth
And be strong before the Lord of Spirits.
Him playing fast-and-loose with this text raises a disturbing question. If he is this careless with a non-canonical text in a debate, crafting a quote solely for the purpose of appearing to gain a foothold, how can he be trusted when confronted with scriptures inconducive for non-Preexistence?
Another point of irony is that, in the debate Dustin referred to contemporary Jewish works like the Talmud and to the Apocrypha as it was in the LXX that he said Christians viewed as scripture, (and the Testaments, 4 Ezra, Philo, Josephus) but he denied David’s use of the contemporary Jewish work of 1 Enoch even though we know Jude 14-15 is very similar to 1 Enoch 1:9. This is academically appalling.
See another critique of one of his debate tactics in the same debate:
- Isaiah 44:24 - Jehovah alone made all things, and both Unitarians and Trinitarians get it wrong.
youtu.be/RVCBoyMDcPM
